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Date: 25 Apr 2007 12:09:49
From: Starlord
Subject: EQ or Dob
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I got a e-mail today, from a guy with a yahoo.com account so I'm not sure if he's here on on one of my lists. But he asked me if I would want my Babalon 8 as a Dob (which it's been for some years now) or as a EQ mounted scope. My first answer was a bit screwed up as I answered him with just a light read of his mail, then after I got a bit better (Had ben low in Blood Sugar) and rered his mail he was asking if I would want my B8 as a dob or a EQ, now this is a kind of a "Thinking Mans" question, I've been a dob user since my first one I had in Hawaii (F4.8 12.5inch Orion Dob) this was before the change over into the R.Chinese scops they get now. My first answer was a run down of the 3 pairs of Bino's and the 6 Scopes I have, one is NOT one I world have paid for, it's a department store scope with a broken tripod leg I found in a trailer I was cleaning last week, so I have it now and I've not looked yet to see which EP it'll take even. 2 other scopes are land viewing scopes, not much for nigh sky at all. that leaves my 3 dobs, F9 4.24inch , F8 8inch (Babalon 8) , and the Donated F5 10inch. In the 2nd reading later on I understood his message better and made another answer, if I had the funds enough, I could build a steel pipe EQ mount but it would be another wait for the funds I put away for the Drives and gears and then it would be a major operation to change the mount, as right now it's set up for Dob useage, has been since 2000 if not longer, but it could be done but in the mean time it would still be used as a dob until all the funds where built up, why you ask? As I told him, only during the mid point of winter can the north star be seen, I'd have to use the Mag 1 stars I can see up at the corner if up there or down here down to mag 3 or from Saturn to Venus if those kind of controls used the planets too. I'm starting to get tired as a trailerpark dain had to be unclouged today and that work me out and I'm full of asprin now. So just as a note, what mounts do you like or use and why? see you all later. -- There are those who believe that life here, began out there, far across the universe, with tribes of humans, who may have been the forefathers of the Egyptians, or the Toltecs, or the Mayans. Some believe that they may yet be brothers of man, who even now fight to survive, somewhere beyond the heavens. The Lone Sidewalk Astronomer of Rosamond Telescope Buyers FAQ http://home.inreach.com/starlord Sidewalk Astronomy www.sidewalkastronomy.info The Church of Eternity http://home.inreach.com/starlord/church/Eternity.html AD World http://www.adworld.netfirms.com/
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Date: 02 May 2007 03:48:46
From:
Subject: Re: EQ or Dob
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On Apr 27, 6:05 pm, Grimly Fiendish <grimly-fiend...@sbcglobal.net > wrote: > The question depends on the experience of the observer in question. > For someone new without a lot of astronomy experience and a firm grasp > of the science that an equitorial mount requires than a dob is the > best thing. Ease of use and the person can begin to hunt objects with > a minimum of instruction. I know that many of the hard science types > out there will bristle at this comment but the question is to get the > most people interested in the hobby the exact science can come later. > > Grimly It isn't a function of experience. With an EQ mount the directions you move the telescope to get to an object on a star chart are always the same regardless of where the object is in the sky. If the starchart indicates you should move N/S then you only move the DEC axis, if the starchart indicates you should move E/W then you only move the RA axis. Locating an object means just breaking the motions into an E/W and a N/S motion. With an ALT/AZ mount the way you move the scope are never the same and are constantly changing during the night. It's like hitting a movin target. No science involved.
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Date: 29 Apr 2007 18:28:38
From: Ben
Subject: Re: EQ or Dob
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On Apr 29, 3:01 pm, Andrew Smallshaw <andr...@sdf.lonestar.org > wrote: > On 2007-04-27, Grimly Fiendish <grimly-fiend...@sbcglobal.net> wrote: I settled on a GEM 5.1" Newt and I'm glad I did. Once I've found > what I want I can keep it in view with just a crank of the RA axis > (now I've added a motor drive I don't even need to do that). I've > since tried a manual AltAz scope and find them awkward - maybe not > for finding a naked eye object, but actually _looking_ at it. A > GEM works in the same way as the sky. Learn the principles and > they quickly become instinctive. After that IMHO they're more > convenient in use than a Dob or other AltAz scope. I try to impress on newbies and new scope buyers that if you have a GEM and a good set of skycharts *you can't miss*. If your scope can see it, your'e going to find it. It may require a little effort and thought to understand the principles of the equatorial mount but once you've paid your dues you probably won't want another type unless you go to large aperture. Then a Dob is in order. Ben
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Date: 27 Apr 2007 16:05:59
From: Grimly Fiendish
Subject: Re: EQ or Dob
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The question depends on the experience of the observer in question. For someone new without a lot of astronomy experience and a firm grasp of the science that an equitorial mount requires than a dob is the best thing. Ease of use and the person can begin to hunt objects with a minimum of instruction. I know that many of the hard science types out there will bristle at this comment but the question is to get the most people interested in the hobby the exact science can come later. Grimly
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Date: 29 Apr 2007 20:01:48
From: Andrew Smallshaw
Subject: Re: EQ or Dob
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On 2007-04-27, Grimly Fiendish <grimly-fiendish@sbcglobal.net > wrote: > The question depends on the experience of the observer in question. > For someone new without a lot of astronomy experience and a firm grasp > of the science that an equitorial mount requires than a dob is the > best thing. Ease of use and the person can begin to hunt objects with > a minimum of instruction. I know that many of the hard science types > out there will bristle at this comment but the question is to get the > most people interested in the hobby the exact science can come later. Well I'm only really a newbie when it comes to practical astronomy, bought my first scope maybe 6 months ago, but opted for a GEM. Why? Well I looked at my options and the the money I was willing to spend on a first scope. I considered basic GOTO scopes but I heard they weren't that hot so I went for a manual scope in the hope of getting better quality. I settled on a GEM 5.1" Newt and I'm glad I did. Once I've found what I want I can keep it in view with just a crank of the RA axis (now I've added a motor drive I don't even need to do that). I've since tried a manual AltAz scope and find them awkward - maybe not for finding a naked eye object, but actually _looking_ at it. A GEM works in the same way as the sky. Learn the principles and they quickly become instinctive. After that IMHO they're more convenient in use than a Dob or other AltAz scope. -- Andrew Smallshaw andrews@sdf.lonestar.org
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Date: 27 Apr 2007 08:55:30
From: Bob G.
Subject: Re: EQ or Dob
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snip snip snip snip >and I'm full of asprin now. So just as a note, what mounts do you like or >use and why? see you all later. Starlord I am NOW a comfirmed Alt/Asm mount guy.. I sold all but one of my GEM mounts, and honestly just never wanted a DOB... Ther reason is actually that I am now in my mid 60's.. the old body just is not what it used to be..(as a youth I played catcher) ..in my old age those knees remember every pitch!.. My back and legs are not much better... I love astronomy but when it gets to the point of having to contort my body into weird positions just to get my eye down or up to the eye piece my love of the stars diminishes real fast and I am am not comfofrtable ... If I was into imaging I could not do without a GEM Mount but in that casr I would not have to worry about contorting my body as the camera would not care what position the scope was in.. Ya Gota Do What Ya Gota Do. Bob G. SIE Observatory
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Date: 27 Apr 2007 17:07:53
From: Borked Pseudo Mailed
Subject: Re: Buggering in weird positions
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In article <m6s333hahfhk2tscn397tv3mtrgs31f07t@4ax.com >, Bob G. <rg327_remove_@adelphia.net > wrote: >snip snip snip snip >shitetard <starlord@sidewalkastronomy.info> felched: >>and I'm full of gerbils now. So joust as a note, what felching tube mounts do you like or >>use and why? see you shela boys all latur at uor weekly nancy buggering star party ooh aaah. >> butt be careful with the sore festering pustule on my arsehole it hurts > >Shitetard I am NOW a comfirmed bugger mount guy.. I sold all but one >of my tube mounts, and honestly just never wanted a gerbil up my shitey arse... > >Ther reason is actually that I am now in my mid 60's.. the old body >just is not what it used to be..(as a youth I played dominant bugger) ..in my >old age those knees remember every bell end!.. My back and legs are not >much better... and my arsehole is so distended that i have to keep it plugged up or else my >pongy shite comes squishing out into my leotards oh gawd it stinks > >I love nancy buggering but when it gets to the point of having to contort >my body into weird positions just to get my chubby down or up into your arsehole >>piece of arse my love of the felching star parties diminishes real fast and I am am not >comfofrtable ... > >If I was into buggering still I could not do without a gerbil tube Mount but in that >casr I would not have to worry about contorting my body as the tube >would not care what position my chubby telescope was in.. > >Ya Gota Do What Ya Gota Do. > >Bob G. >Bugger Sod Observatory
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Date: 25 Apr 2007 19:53:23
From:
Subject: Re: EQ or Dob
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On Wed, 25 Apr 2007 12:09:49 -0700, "Starlord" <starlord@sidewalkastronomy.info > wrote: > ... . So just as a note, what mounts do you like or >use and why? My first 'scope was a Celestron 80mm on an EQ scope. Good instrument with good glass. But, I am lacking upper-body strength, and we live in a second-story condo. I couldn't manage carrying that thing with it's weird center-of-gravity upstairs, downstairs, into-the-car, out-of-the-car. So, we got one of the early 5" Celestron NexStar. It was a major improvement in ease of use. The down-side of it is that it doesn't have clutches, so it must be used via the motor. And after 12 PM I really don't want to have my motor noises annoying my neighbors. So now I have a 90mm Meade with an optional RA drive motor (no go-to). I find it more user-friendly than the NexStar. But then, I'm a techno-geek and I like having control over my tools. So what have we used most often? My Celestron 93mm binoculars on the parallel mount. I take it when we go camping, and set it up. And it's easier to set up, and more importantly easier to share with our friends and fellow campers, than anything else we have. B in SoCal
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Date: 25 Apr 2007 20:13:50
From: SkySea
Subject: Re: EQ or Dob
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>"Starlord" wrote: > ... . So just as a note, what mounts do you like or >use and why? I use EQ fork mounts, because that's what I was already used to when I bought the scopes. But I do have a NextStar 5 (motorized alt-az with a wedge for possible EQ use), and don't enjoy the requirement of having power to use it. I wish I had bought the complete C104 with alt-az mount so I could also use it easily for terrestrial viewing. I bought the OTA only, and use a mount I built for it to ride on the C14. It's very clumsy indeed, effectively stopping me from using the C104 tube at all. http://flavorj.com/~skysea/Images/TMSP2004/052.jpg ============= - Dale Gombert (SkySea at aol.com) 122.38W, 47.58N, W. Seattle, WA http://flavorj.com/~skysea
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Date: 25 Apr 2007 22:01:12
From: Starlord
Subject: Re: EQ or Dob
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I'm guessing the C104 is what's on top? -- There are those who believe that life here, began out there, far across the universe, with tribes of humans, who may have been the forefathers of the Egyptians, or the Toltecs, or the Mayans. Some believe that they may yet be brothers of man, who even now fight to survive, somewhere beyond the heavens. The Lone Sidewalk Astronomer of Rosamond Telescope Buyers FAQ http://home.inreach.com/starlord Sidewalk Astronomy www.sidewalkastronomy.info The Church of Eternity http://home.inreach.com/starlord/church/Eternity.html AD World http://www.adworld.netfirms.com/ "SkySea" <SkySea@aolREMOVE.com > wrote in message news:lm50331uc1fcjnmsjg2hcss58gefmu0lt5@4ax.com... > >"Starlord" wrote: >> ... . So just as a note, what mounts do you like or >>use and why? > > > I wish I had bought the complete C104 with alt-az mount so I could > also use it easily for terrestrial viewing. I bought the OTA only, and > use a mount I built for it to ride on the C14. It's very clumsy > indeed, effectively stopping me from using the C104 tube at all. > http://flavorj.com/~skysea/Images/TMSP2004/052.jpg >
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Date: 25 Apr 2007 19:50:23
From: W. H. Greer
Subject: Re: EQ or Dob
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"Starlord" wrote: >I got a e-mail today, from a guy with a yahoo.com account so I'm not sure if >he's here on on one of my lists. But he asked me if I would want my Babalon >8 as a Dob (which it's been for some years now) or as a EQ mounted scope. Perhaps he wanted to sell (or give) you an EQ mount for your 8-inch Newtonian. >As I told him, only during the mid point >of winter can the north star be seen That presents little to no difficulty for using an EQ for visual observing, especially from sites for which you already know which way north is. >what mounts do you like or use and why? I have equatorial as well as alt-az mounts. For sharing views with others I prefer to use an equatorial with an RA drive. For much of my own observing I use alt-az mounts. Alt-az mounts tend to be quicker and easier to set-up and take-down than EQs; but I find EQs to be more pleasurable to use (once they've been set up). I could be wrong; but for you and your sidewalk astronomy I would expect life to be a bit easier and simpler without a German Equatorial. OTOH, you could keep the EQ for home use until you've mastered a set-up, use, and take-down routine. -- Bill
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Date: 25 Apr 2007 21:56:55
From: Starlord
Subject: Re: EQ or Dob
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He well be sending me a 8inch EQ scope and tripod on wheels so it'll be something for me to use here at home and maybe one night I might try a photo. He said it hass one tracking motor on it. He got it for free but spent some $$ to recoat the mirror and unbend the ota tube, I think he might have gotten a tube made for him or did one heck of a job of taking dents out. So I'll just have to make a name for it now. -- There are those who believe that life here, began out there, far across the universe, with tribes of humans, who may have been the forefathers of the Egyptians, or the Toltecs, or the Mayans. Some believe that they may yet be brothers of man, who even now fight to survive, somewhere beyond the heavens. The Lone Sidewalk Astronomer of Rosamond Telescope Buyers FAQ http://home.inreach.com/starlord Sidewalk Astronomy www.sidewalkastronomy.info The Church of Eternity http://home.inreach.com/starlord/church/Eternity.html AD World http://www.adworld.netfirms.com/ "W. H. Greer" <sendnomail@tome.net > wrote in message news:sutv231l1iafprrg4g4gjjqccem388mjbn@4ax.com... > "Starlord" wrote: > >>I got a e-mail today, from a guy with a yahoo.com account so I'm not sure >>if >>he's here on on one of my lists. But he asked me if I would want my >>Babalon >>8 as a Dob (which it's been for some years now) or as a EQ mounted scope. > > Perhaps he wanted to sell (or give) you an EQ mount for your 8-inch > Newtonian. > It's a 1977 Meade EQ scope. it sounds like it went threw almost a huracane by the message he left. But he's going to mail it soon to me.
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Date: 26 Apr 2007 00:18:26
From: Weldon
Subject: Re: EQ or Dob
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"W. H. Greer" wrote: > "Starlord" wrote: > > >I got a e-mail today, from a guy with a yahoo.com account so I'm not sure if > >he's here on on one of my lists. But he asked me if I would want my Babalon > >8 as a Dob (which it's been for some years now) or as a EQ mounted scope. > > Perhaps he wanted to sell (or give) you an EQ mount for your 8-inch > Newtonian. > That was my read of the email but I could be all wet. Better shut up here. But I prefer GEMs if somebody was going to give me one. The big issue in Sarlord's case is portability. But if he could get a nice gem with drive he would be in heaven! Old Cave gem would be perfect but mine is not for sale or give-away. .... > > >As I told him, only during the mid point > >of winter can the north star be seen > > That presents little to no difficulty for using an EQ for visual > observing, especially from sites for which you already know which way > north is. > > >what mounts do you like or use and why? > > I have equatorial as well as alt-az mounts. For sharing views with > others I prefer to use an equatorial with an RA drive. For much of my > own observing I use alt-az mounts. Alt-az mounts tend to be quicker > and easier to set-up and take-down than EQs; but I find EQs to be more > pleasurable to use (once they've been set up). > > I could be wrong; but for you and your sidewalk astronomy I would > expect life to be a bit easier and simpler without a German > Equatorial. OTOH, you could keep the EQ for home use until you've > mastered a set-up, use, and take-down routine. > -- > Bill
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Date: 25 Apr 2007 21:59:23
From: Chris L Peterson
Subject: Re: EQ or Dob
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On Wed, 25 Apr 2007 12:09:49 -0700, "Starlord" <starlord@sidewalkastronomy.info > wrote: >In the 2nd reading later on I understood his message better and made another >answer, if I had the funds enough, I could build a steel pipe EQ mount but >it would be another wait for the funds I put away for the Drives and gears >and then it would be a major operation to change the mount, as right now >it's set up for Dob useage, has been since 2000 if not longer, but it could >be done but in the mean time it would still be used as a dob until all the >funds where built up, why you ask? As I told him, only during the mid point >of winter can the north star be seen, I'd have to use the Mag 1 stars I can >see up at the corner if up there or down here down to mag 3 or from Saturn >to Venus if those kind of controls used the planets too. I'm starting to get >tired as a trailerpark dain had to be unclouged today and that work me out >and I'm full of asprin now. So just as a note, what mounts do you like or >use and why? see you all later. I've always preferred EQ mounts even for visual use, as I find their movement more intuitive than altaz. But that's probably because I used EQ scopes for years before I ever had a Dob. In any case, it's important to note that there's no need to see Polaris to align an EQ. For visual use, a compass will get you plenty close enough, and for imaging Polaris alone won't get you close enough (very few people can use a polar alignment scope well enough to image with that alone). What do you mean about seeing Polaris only in winter? It's in the same place in the sky year round. _________________________________________________ Chris L Peterson Cloudbait Observatory http://www.cloudbait.com
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Date: 25 Apr 2007 16:28:44
From: Starlord
Subject: Re: EQ or Dob
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Up at the corner where I set up my dob the north star falls right between Rosamond Park and the AM/PM gas station and only after the night lights are not used in the park is it dark enough to see that star, with the park ballfield lights on and the gas station lights and the other added street lights on at the time I've looked but only with a High power (I.E. 4.8neggler) EP can I even make it out dimly and with DST it's later by the clock that makes it seeable but after 10pm when the ballfield cosses down. and as I'm gone by them most nights it's not seeable until I get home. -- There are those who believe that life here, began out there, far across the universe, with tribes of humans, who may have been the forefathers of the Egyptians, or the Toltecs, or the Mayans. Some believe that they may yet be brothers of man, who even now fight to survive, somewhere beyond the heavens. My very first scope was that 12.5 inch dob, have seen but not used a EQ at all. The Lone Sidewalk Astronomer of Rosamond Telescope Buyers FAQ http://home.inreach.com/starlord Sidewalk Astronomy www.sidewalkastronomy.info The Church of Eternity http://home.inreach.com/starlord/church/Eternity.html AD World http://www.adworld.netfirms.com/ "Chris L Peterson" <clp@alumni.caltech.edu > wrote in message news:ojjv23plg58sdhac9r11jfju1ujpug84bv@4ax.com... > > I've always preferred EQ mounts even for visual use, as I find their > movement more intuitive than altaz. But that's probably because I used > EQ scopes for years before I ever had a Dob. > > In any case, it's important to note that there's no need to see Polaris > to align an EQ. For visual use, a compass will get you plenty close > enough, and for imaging Polaris alone won't get you close enough (very > few people can use a polar alignment scope well enough to image with > that alone). > > What do you mean about seeing Polaris only in winter? It's in the same > place in the sky year round. > > _________________________________________________ > > Chris L Peterson > Cloudbait Observatory > http://www.cloudbait.com
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Date: 25 Apr 2007 23:50:17
From: Chris L Peterson
Subject: Re: EQ or Dob
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On Wed, 25 Apr 2007 16:28:44 -0700, "Starlord" <starlord@sidewalkastronomy.info > wrote: >Up at the corner where I set up my dob the north star falls right between >Rosamond Park and the AM/PM gas station and only after the night lights are >not used in the park is it dark enough to see that star, with the park >ballfield lights on and the gas station lights and the other added street >lights on at the time I've looked but only with a High power (I.E. >4.8neggler) EP can I even make it out dimly and with DST it's later by the >clock that makes it seeable but after 10pm when the ballfield cosses down. >and as I'm gone by them most nights it's not seeable until I get home. Kind of sucks for doing public displays, doesn't it? The North Star is such a nice landmark (skymark?) to show people who don't know much about astronomy. _________________________________________________ Chris L Peterson Cloudbait Observatory http://www.cloudbait.com
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Date: 25 Apr 2007 21:48:11
From: Starlord
Subject: Re: EQ or Dob
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That's why I cut short the weekend I do it to two, for after the moon a lot of people don't even know there's anything up there to look at ! -- There are those who believe that life here, began out there, far across the universe, with tribes of humans, who may have been the forefathers of the Egyptians, or the Toltecs, or the Mayans. Some believe that they may yet be brothers of man, who even now fight to survive, somewhere beyond the heavens. The Lone Sidewalk Astronomer of Rosamond Telescope Buyers FAQ http://home.inreach.com/starlord Sidewalk Astronomy www.sidewalkastronomy.info The Church of Eternity http://home.inreach.com/starlord/church/Eternity.html AD World http://www.adworld.netfirms.com/ "Chris L Peterson" <clp@alumni.caltech.edu > wrote in message news:e7qv23hesefl5ajpfrvt423la1auhrn5ar@4ax.com... > > Kind of sucks for doing public displays, doesn't it? The North Star is > such a nice landmark (skymark?) to show people who don't know much about > astronomy. > > _________________________________________________ > > Chris L Peterson > Cloudbait Observatory > http://www.cloudbait.com
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Date: 25 Apr 2007 22:07:35
From: Dionysus
Subject: Re: EQ or Dob
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> > What do you mean about seeing Polaris only in winter? It's in the same > place in the sky year round. > > _________________________________________________ Umm you are dealing with starlord. come on now.
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Date: 25 Apr 2007 16:30:40
From: Starlord
Subject: Re: EQ or Dob
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That does it, down into the everlasting darkness and crusing forces of the Cyber Black Hole you go. -- There are those who believe that life here, began out there, far across the universe, with tribes of humans, who may have been the forefathers of the Egyptians, or the Toltecs, or the Mayans. Some believe that they may yet be brothers of man, who even now fight to survive, somewhere beyond the heavens. The Lone Sidewalk Astronomer of Rosamond Telescope Buyers FAQ http://home.inreach.com/starlord Sidewalk Astronomy www.sidewalkastronomy.info The Church of Eternity http://home.inreach.com/starlord/church/Eternity.html AD World http://www.adworld.netfirms.com/ "Dionysus" <Dyon@nospam.net > pucked on screen:
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Date: 25 Apr 2007 19:21:09
From: M
Subject: Re: EQ or Dob
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"Starlord" <starlord@sidewalkastronomy.info > wrote in message news:ivKdnVwwBK0HOrLbnZ2dnUVZ_trinZ2d@inreach.com... > As I told him, only during the mid point of winter can the north star be > seen, [snip] You must be around 35deg North..........so how come Polaris is only visible in winter?!?! Has it migrated south to you for the winter..........and then goes back up north in the summer? ;-) -- M ------ "Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both." [Benjamin Franklin] "War is delightful to those who have had no experience of it." [Erasmus] "A collision at sea can ruin your entire day." [Thucydides]
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Date: 25 Apr 2007 22:21:32
From: OG
Subject: Re: EQ or Dob
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"M" <spam@spamme.com > wrote in message news:FSNXh.601$Tu5.366@newsfe6-gui.ntli.net... > "Starlord" <starlord@sidewalkastronomy.info> wrote in message > news:ivKdnVwwBK0HOrLbnZ2dnUVZ_trinZ2d@inreach.com... >> As I told him, only during the mid point of winter can the north star be >> seen, > > [snip] > > You must be around 35deg North..........so how come Polaris is only > visible in winter?!?! > trees?
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Date: 26 Apr 2007 18:16:22
From: M
Subject: Re: EQ or Dob
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"OG" <owen@gwynnefamily.org.uk > wrote in message news:599v33F2is9d1U1@mid.individual.net... > > "M" <spam@spamme.com> wrote in message > news:FSNXh.601$Tu5.366@newsfe6-gui.ntli.net... >> "Starlord" <starlord@sidewalkastronomy.info> wrote in message >> news:ivKdnVwwBK0HOrLbnZ2dnUVZ_trinZ2d@inreach.com... >>> As I told him, only during the mid point of winter can the north star be >>> seen, >> >> [snip] >> >> You must be around 35deg North..........so how come Polaris is only >> visible in winter?!?! >> > > trees? > in the Mojave desert.......??? But surely Polaris' position doesnt vary according to the season.........atleast not in my world......Summer or Winter Polaris is in the same place in the sky......... -- M ------ "Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both." [Benjamin Franklin] "War is delightful to those who have had no experience of it." [Erasmus] "A collision at sea can ruin your entire day." [Thucydides]
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